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Former UK ambassador says Syrian Chemical Attacks were Staged - BBC interview.


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#81 J-CA

    Probably in one of my drunken stupors..

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Posted 22 May 2019 - 04:34 PM

This whole thing is just the equivalent of someone FOIAing the emails of a prominent scientist and then finding that scientist and another scientist arguing about something in a paper and then concluding on that basis that the paper is invalid and thus global warming is a giant hoax. The whole point of this is to use some technical squabble to somehow refute the enormous amount of evidence that the Syrians have gassed their own people many, many times. And then after that we are supposed to decide that despite the government bombing hospitals and schools the White Helmets are the real terrorists.
This is just getting played by very basic propaganda techniques, it is stupid.

Or Roger Waters will show us all the real truth I guess.
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#82 J-CA

    Probably in one of my drunken stupors..

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Posted 22 May 2019 - 06:33 PM

Has anyone read the actual document? I just started reading it, now I know why this is a non-story:
http://syriapropagan...uary-2019-1.pdf
When you get to page 6, item 25 you can see what this is all about. The physical characteristics of this particular strike differ from other observed stikes in that the cylinder in question didn't suffer any damage passing through the ceiling of the room it landed in.. because the hole in question was probably made by mortar or artillery round.
I am the burrito until someone hands me to a philosopher.

#83 George Rowell

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Posted 22 May 2019 - 06:48 PM

View PostJ-CA, on 22 May 2019 - 06:33 PM, said:

Has anyone read the actual document? I just started reading it, now I know why this is a non-story:
http://syriapropagan...uary-2019-1.pdf
When you get to page 6, item 25 you can see what this is all about. The physical characteristics of this particular strike differ from other observed stikes in that the cylinder in question didn't suffer any damage passing through the ceiling of the room it landed in.. because the hole in question was probably made by mortar or artillery round.
An engineer you are not. If that were the case the bomb would of gone right through the bed and the floor below too.
A doctor knows a little about a lot. A specialist knows a lot about a little. In time the doctor knows less and less about more and more and the specialist knows more and more about less and less until ultimately the doctor knows nothing about everything and the specialist knows everything about nothing.

#84 J-CA

    Probably in one of my drunken stupors..

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Posted 22 May 2019 - 09:12 PM

View PostGeorge Rowell, on 22 May 2019 - 06:48 PM, said:

An engineer you are not. If that were the case the bomb would of gone right through the bed and the floor below too.
No "bombs" involved here.

All this report indicates is that no one knows exactly how that cylinder got there, that's it. Just like my first post said, this is just people studying something, trying to figure out what might have happened and selective leaking is sending every wack-a-doodle Assad sympathizer jumping on it like it is evidence of some multinational conspiracy.
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#85 George Rowell

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Posted 22 May 2019 - 09:41 PM

The whole point is 'cylinder' was meant to be dropped from a helicopter by the order of evil Assad. That is why we sent off scores of missiles.

A cylinder dropped from a helicopter hovering at 500m would arrive through the open hole in the roof you described, after a ten second journey, at 100m/s. That is getting on for 340ft per second, the low end speed (400-800fps) of a Colt45 bullet!

A 50Kg bullet hitting a bed would be a sight to behold.
A doctor knows a little about a lot. A specialist knows a lot about a little. In time the doctor knows less and less about more and more and the specialist knows more and more about less and less until ultimately the doctor knows nothing about everything and the specialist knows everything about nothing.

#86 George Rowell

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Posted 23 May 2019 - 11:22 PM

Here is an article about the OPCW leak in the Independent by Robert Fisk. (BTW, try finding it with a google search - I doubt you will get lucky).

https://www.independ...a-a8927116.html

"The OPCW officially maintains that these canisters were probably dropped by an aircraft – probably a helicopter, presumably Syrian – over Douma on 7 April 2018. But the dissenting assessment, which the OPCW made no reference to in its published conclusions, finds there is a “higher probability that both cylinders were manually placed at those two locations rather than being delivered from aircraft”.

It is difficult to underestimate the seriousness of this manipulative act by the OPCW."



I agree!
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#87 George Rowell

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Posted 25 May 2019 - 01:41 AM

The official version that the cylinder was dropped from a helicopter has been debunked under every different analysis performed. The size and the shape of the hole in the roof, the crushing of the cylinder and the placing of the cylinder, but the most devastating evidence in the cases of both cylinders are the energy equations on both accounts.

1) The potential energy in both cases from a 500m drop, the absolute minimum height, would still be far in access of the actual crushing observed on BOTH cylinders.
2) Despite the evidence in one above, it transpires that the kinetic energy of the cylinder was magically exactly equal to the energy required to penetrate the roof, not too much, not too little, EXACTLY, so that the cylinder floated down the last couple of meters to gently rest on the bed.

The report completely destroys the theory that the cylinder was dropped from an aircraft. But the report has been stonewalled by the main stream media.

What to expect now? That is easy:-
Continued stone walling to see if the problem goes away.
Proclaim the author, Ian Henderson, was not on the real team, maybe a fringe expect who was consulted for his personal opinion.
Dismiss Ian Henderson's professional ability, maybe personal character.
Concoct another report or two that do support the helicopter theory.

Come on TRS, where are you, something stinks, why is the press not roaring 'Fake', 'Staged', 'OPCW Compromised'? The silence is deafening.
A doctor knows a little about a lot. A specialist knows a lot about a little. In time the doctor knows less and less about more and more and the specialist knows more and more about less and less until ultimately the doctor knows nothing about everything and the specialist knows everything about nothing.

#88 AnBr

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Posted 25 May 2019 - 04:03 PM

Sigh
Pray for Trump: Psalm 109:8

"Science is more than a body of knowledge; it is a way of thinking. I have a foreboding of an America in my children's or grandchildren's time - when the United States is a service and information economy; when nearly all the key manufacturing industries have slipped away to other countries; when awesome technological powers arc in the hands of a very few, and no one representing the public interest can even grasp the issues; when the people have lost the ability to set their own agendas or knowledgeably question those in authority; when, clutching our crystals and nervously consulting our horoscopes, our critical faculties in decline, unable to distinguish between what feels good and what's true, we slide, almost without noticing, back into superstition and darkness.

— Carl Sagan
The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark
1995


“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

— H.L. Mencken
On Politics: A Carnival of Buncombe


“The test of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little.”

— Franklin Delano Roosevelt
Second inaugural address January, 1937

#89 Rich T Bikkies

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Posted 25 May 2019 - 07:20 PM

View PostGeorge Rowell, on 25 May 2019 - 01:41 AM, said:

Come on TRS, where are you, something stinks, why is the press not roaring 'Fake', 'Staged', 'OPCW Compromised'? The silence is deafening.

I think we're all just punch-drunk with outrage fatigue (you know, a sort of second cousin to compassion fatigue). T S Eliot: "Humankind cannot bear too much reality".
Reality is a hallucination caused by alcohol deprivation.

Only Satan can rebuke sin. The righteous don't know enough.

God is not dead. He was merely voted out of office.

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#90 George Rowell

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Posted 25 May 2019 - 08:49 PM

View PostRich T Bikkies, on 25 May 2019 - 07:20 PM, said:

I think we're all just punch-drunk with outrage fatigue (you know, a sort of second cousin to compassion fatigue). T S Eliot: "Humankind cannot bear too much reality".
I know something people will believe. How about this. The report was hacked by the Kremlin to discredit the OPCW. Evil Russians again, that works every time. And it was carried out under the direct orders of Vladimir Putin too. Tell the crowd what they want to hear.

First stone wall it long as possible.
A doctor knows a little about a lot. A specialist knows a lot about a little. In time the doctor knows less and less about more and more and the specialist knows more and more about less and less until ultimately the doctor knows nothing about everything and the specialist knows everything about nothing.

#91 golden_valley

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Posted 26 May 2019 - 10:43 AM

The bottom line is that there is no US support for further intervention in the Middle East...aside from Trump's bellowing and bragging about it. There hasn't been any since before 2012 when Obama drew the line in the sand but realized that Congress wasn't interested in supporting it, nor were the American people.

Incidentally, Russia and the US worked together trying to get rid of chemical weapons back in 2013-14.

#92 J-CA

    Probably in one of my drunken stupors..

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Posted 26 May 2019 - 09:44 PM

I think the main takeaway is the OPCW has accused both sides in the conflict of using chemical agents and the leak of this technical document demonstrates that they are doing thorough assessments of the physical evidence before they come to conclusions. Accusations that they are engaged in some kind of one-sided hit-job on Assad is not supported by the available evidence.
The OPCW has used very specific language in their reports and have in some cases simply declined to attribute sources to attacks.
The reason the mainstream media is not covering this wall-to-wall is because there is no new story here, the story is still, most of the actors in this theatre are bad guys.

But it should be noted that the only actor in this theatre that was already a dictator that was killing his own citizens for dissent was Assad.
I am the burrito until someone hands me to a philosopher.

#93 George Rowell

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Posted 27 May 2019 - 04:14 AM

View PostJ-CA, on 26 May 2019 - 09:44 PM, said:

I think the main takeaway is the OPCW has accused both sides in the conflict of using chemical agents and the leak of this technical document demonstrates that they are doing thorough assessments of the physical evidence before they come to conclusions. Accusations that they are engaged in some kind of one-sided hit-job on Assad is not supported by the available evidence.
The OPCW has used very specific language in their reports and have in some cases simply declined to attribute sources to attacks.
The reason the mainstream media is not covering this wall-to-wall is because there is no new story here, the story is still, most of the actors in this theatre are bad guys.

But it should be noted that the only actor in this theatre that was already a dictator that was killing his own citizens for dissent was Assad.
And your views were formed by what? Yes, Murdoch and Co's media machine. I have given you a long list of alternative coherent sources on the so called Douma chemical attack, including the former head of the British army & military intelligence, two former Syrian ambassadors, another ambassador, the general in charge of the assault on Iraq, the BBC producer who says the scenes in the Douma documentary were staged and finally the devastating leaked OPCW report. The sources are pertain, informed and authoritative but you are incapable of accepting anything that goes against the media machine version. Nothing will change you. You are owned.

My view is that sadly the OPCW is compromised and can no longer be trusted. The mainstream media is no longer 'teasing out the truth' it fact it is stonewalling huge news stories that contradict it's narrative.

Where to go from now? I believe public concern must focus first on the news media and the organisations that control it. But that will not happen.

I have no answers. What saddens me, really saddens me, is intelligent people - the cream of the crop in my opinion (TRS) - do not see a problem. If you cannot then what hope is there? The truth will remain whatever the media machine want it to be.

It is not going to get any better, the media are perfecting their techniques. AI selects, tailors and streams our news, based on Google, FB and our own news clicks, to penetrate our individual mindsets, waylaying our doubts, reinforcing the fake news and ringing our bells.

You will of course disagree with everything I said, but you have no idea how sad that makes me.
A doctor knows a little about a lot. A specialist knows a lot about a little. In time the doctor knows less and less about more and more and the specialist knows more and more about less and less until ultimately the doctor knows nothing about everything and the specialist knows everything about nothing.

#94 J-CA

    Probably in one of my drunken stupors..

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Posted 29 May 2019 - 09:39 AM

I don't know George, only one of us here was tricked into linking to a website that was not the Guardian claiming it was the Guardian.. you are the one often posting links that are clearly build to feed that AI machine. This behaviour speaks for itself.
I am the burrito until someone hands me to a philosopher.

#95 George Rowell

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Posted 29 May 2019 - 07:37 PM

View PostJ-CA, on 29 May 2019 - 09:39 AM, said:

I don't know George, only one of us here was tricked into linking to a website that was not the Guardian claiming it was the Guardian.. you are the one often posting links that are clearly build to feed that AI machine. This behaviour speaks for itself.
That is true J-CA.
I admit it.
A doctor knows a little about a lot. A specialist knows a lot about a little. In time the doctor knows less and less about more and more and the specialist knows more and more about less and less until ultimately the doctor knows nothing about everything and the specialist knows everything about nothing.

#96 Rich T Bikkies

    Trainee Basil Fawlty. Practising Victor Meldrew

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 05:27 AM

View PostGeorge Rowell, on 29 May 2019 - 07:37 PM, said:

That is true J-CA.
I admit it.

GO TO JAIL
GO DIRECTLY TO JAIL
DO NOT PASS GO
DO NOT COLLECT £200
Reality is a hallucination caused by alcohol deprivation.

Only Satan can rebuke sin. The righteous don't know enough.

God is not dead. He was merely voted out of office.

You can do anything with anybody if you just save them the trouble of thinking.

#97 George Rowell

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 06:48 AM

View PostRich T Bikkies, on 30 May 2019 - 05:27 AM, said:

GO TO JAIL
GO DIRECTLY TO JAIL
DO NOT PASS GO
DO NOT COLLECT £200
Two hundred what!!! Bloody pommies still think Britannia rules the waves. Two hundred bucks p-leeze, give Mr C. Darrow his due.
A doctor knows a little about a lot. A specialist knows a lot about a little. In time the doctor knows less and less about more and more and the specialist knows more and more about less and less until ultimately the doctor knows nothing about everything and the specialist knows everything about nothing.





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