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The death of Christianity in the U.S.


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#161 AnBr

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Posted 18 May 2019 - 06:24 PM

View PostBeelzebuddy, on 18 May 2019 - 10:18 AM, said:

This is why I left the faith.

The faith of you?
Pray for Trump: Psalm 109:8

"Science is more than a body of knowledge; it is a way of thinking. I have a foreboding of an America in my children's or grandchildren's time - when the United States is a service and information economy; when nearly all the key manufacturing industries have slipped away to other countries; when awesome technological powers arc in the hands of a very few, and no one representing the public interest can even grasp the issues; when the people have lost the ability to set their own agendas or knowledgeably question those in authority; when, clutching our crystals and nervously consulting our horoscopes, our critical faculties in decline, unable to distinguish between what feels good and what's true, we slide, almost without noticing, back into superstition and darkness.

— Carl Sagan
The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark
1995


“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

— H.L. Mencken
On Politics: A Carnival of Buncombe


“The test of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little.”

— Franklin Delano Roosevelt
Second inaugural address January, 1937

#162 LFC

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Posted 21 May 2019 - 04:24 PM

Child abuse or religious belief? Sounds like both to me. The call is morality, I call it sickness.

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The so-called “purity” culture in the Christian evangelical community has made millions for churches and Christian swag manufacturers. However, it’s been harming millions of teens across the country who made a vow of chastity before marriage.

Statistics reveal that 85 percent of men and 81 percent of women have sex prior to marriage, so the numbers aren’t looking good for the church. For those who made the pledge but fell short of the goal, damaging implications have followed, The Christian Post reported.

“Amid the rise of the #MeToo movement paired with reports of sex abuse within the Church, individuals whose lives were shaped by purity culture began to push back,” the report said. “They shared stories of how some of the more problematic aspects of the movement, though well-intentioned, caused them to have an unhealthy relationship with religion, relationships, and sex.”

Cait West revealed her upbringing in Christian patriarchy where women were to be submissive to male house-heads. Female children were not allowed to date unless it was a courtship seeking marriage. She recalled being “shamed for normal adolescent curiosity.” Any sexual thoughts meant she was basically fornicating.

“Dating was never an option,” she told The Christian Post in an interview. “I was never taught about sex or sexuality at all. I remember asking my parents, testing the waters, ‘What’s this about?’ And they brushed it aside. I was never allowed to explore or ask questions, so I never thought of myself as a sexual being because of that.”

She learned that women being sexual beings were bad. They weren’t allowed to be sexual. Everything was tied to shame. Even clothing had to be approved by her father, who would gauge the “modesty” of the outfit.

“My father would come to the store with me and judge everything I had on,” she said. “That overt male gaze judging my clothing throughout my adolescence and into my 20’s really shaped how I thought of myself because I never thought who I was from my perspective.”

That shame then turned to anxiety. It wasn’t until she left the faith at 25 that she began to explore the emotional damage that had been done. She called it “emotional, physical and spiritual trauma.”

“I felt very disconnected from my own body because I was never taught about the sexual part of me,” she said. “I didn’t want to think about my own body or explore my own sexuality because it was a dirty part of me I wasn’t allowed to explore. It made me feel weird about living in my own body, and I didn’t realize just how much I hated my own body until I left the movement.”

As a spouse, she now struggles to think of sex as something intimate for partners and not purely for procreation.

“I’ve had a lot of trouble with disassociation in sexually intimate moments because it’s too much for me to be present in my own body because it feels bad,” she explained. “For years, you’re told something is bad — and then suddenly you get married and you’re supposed to be OK with it. It was like I was trained not to have that part of me turned on or be aware of things.”

“I’ve been working through that process of figuring out what those toxic messages were and re-train myself to have agency,” she added.

" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer

#163 LFC

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Posted 21 May 2019 - 04:33 PM

Another paragon of Christianist morality and one who was in Trump's club of the self-righteous.

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A former member of President Donald Trump’s evangelical advisory board is under investigation for allegedly trying to hire a hitman to murder his former son-in-law.

James MacDonald, founder of Harvest Bible Chapel, was accused by his former bodyguard Emmanuel “Manny” Bucur and Chicago radio personality Mancow Muller of seeking someone to kill former son-in-law Tony Groves, reported independent journalist Julie Roys.

Muller claims MacDonald, who was fired in February from the megachurch he founded, asked him at least twice last year if he knew someone to hire as a hitman, which the broadcaster initially took as a joke but came to realize after talking in December that the pastor was serious.

Bucur, the pastor’s volunteer bodyguard and a deacon at the church, claims MacDonald asked him in 2015 to kill Graves and offered to help dispose of the remains.

He didn’t initially report MacDonald’s request because he was upset the pastor’s daughter had been hurt, and thought perhaps it was just a temporary lapse in judgment.

Bucur said MacDonald asked him to kill Graves while they were on a motorcycle trip to Creation Museum in Petersburg, Kentucky, along with other senior church leaders.

Over breakfast at a restaurant in nearby Indiana, MacDonald asked the bodyguard to “take Tony out” as he searched pornographic websites for material he believed his son-in-law may have uploaded of his daughter.

“Are you asking me what I think you’re asking me?” Bucur recalled asking.

MacDonald confirmed the request, but Bucur refused and asked the pastor to drop the topic and never speak of it again.

Muller said he filed a police report near his Wilmette, Illinois, home and said he’s terrified of MacDonald — whom he called “dangerous” and fears has targeted him.

" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer

#164 HockeyDon

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Posted 24 May 2019 - 09:27 AM

View PostRich T Bikkies, on 17 May 2019 - 02:22 PM, said:

In the event I ever meet this person (and it's unlikely I will, being on a different continent), I wonder whether he'd think my religion is an insult to human dignity? He'd probably think I was another Elwood P Dowd, except that I call my pal God, not Harvey, and I never picture him to myself as a rabbit. So a first draft of the answer is perhaps "Yes".

My unequivocal answer is, "Yes. Religion is an affront to human dignity."

One major component to why I like that quote is that religion convinces people to abdicate their critical thinking skills/abilities to another. If instead I were to say to someone on this board, "Just let me do your thinking for you on this topic", that is a direct affront to their dignity. Because what I'm really saying is "You are simply too inept to have or form their own opinion."

(Just imagine me saying that in the Guns thread to Practical Girl or Traveler or one of the other TRS members who are more strongly "anti-gun", if I may be forgiven for using so crude a term. You weren't around for some of the most intense debates early in that thread, but let me assure you if I had said something like that it would have been the single most offensive reply I could have given. And such a reply would have, rightly so, greatly devalued my contributions to that discussion.)
Well, fuck.

How can I be expected to distinguish BS from reality when so much of my reality is utter BS?!

"There seems to be a lot of people dying of ignorance while living in the information age." my sister-in-law.

#165 Rich T Bikkies

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Posted 24 May 2019 - 09:39 AM

View PostRich T Bikkies, on 17 May 2019 - 02:22 PM, said:

In the event I ever meet this person (and it's unlikely I will, being on a different continent), I wonder whether he'd think my religion is an insult to human dignity?

View PostHockeyDon, on 24 May 2019 - 09:27 AM, said:

My unequivocal answer is, "Yes. Religion is an affront to human dignity."

So: he is entitled to think my religion is an affront to human dignity, because it is an objective fact that (all) religion is an affront to human dignity.

Yep. I'm up to speed on that. Not that I think that my religion is an affront to human dignity; just that he and you are entitled to think so.
Reality is a hallucination caused by alcohol deprivation.

Only Satan can rebuke sin. The righteous don't know enough.

God is not dead. He was merely voted out of office.

You can do anything with anybody if you just save them the trouble of thinking.

#166 Rue Bella

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Posted 24 May 2019 - 09:40 AM

Quote

My unequivocal answer is, "Yes. Religion is an affront to human dignity."

One major component to why I like that quote is that religion convinces people to abdicate their critical thinking skills/abilities to another. If instead I were to say to someone on this board, "Just let me do your thinking for you on this topic", that is a direct affront to their dignity. Because what I'm really saying is "You are simply too inept to have or form their own opinion."

I've come to believe religion is massively codependent. Other words for your thoughts, HD. Most believers surrender their own opinions/decisions for those of another (their god or preacher). Just like the abused spouse or child who, under the threat of punishment, must surrender their own thoughts for those of their 'better half'. Being hit or verbally abused or going to hell.
What is wrong with these people? ~ PG

No longer politically correct

#167 Rich T Bikkies

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Posted 24 May 2019 - 09:55 AM

View PostRue Bella, on 24 May 2019 - 09:40 AM, said:

I've come to believe religion is massively codependent. Other words for your thoughts, HD. Most believers surrender their own opinions/decisions for those of another (their god or preacher).

Yep. Nailed it. Just what I have done. I've been doing it for the last eight years. To God (or "my god", if you prefer), not any particular preacher. My only complaint about your word "codependent" is that it has a pejorative meaning that I feel is inappropriate in my case.

View PostRue Bella, on 24 May 2019 - 09:40 AM, said:

Just like the abused spouse or child who, under the threat of punishment, must surrender their own thoughts for those of their 'better half'. Being hit or verbally abused or going to hell.

Nope. Nothing like that. Another interesting development in the last eight years is that I have been delivered from the fear of punishment, or of being metaphorically or literally abused, or of going to hell. I suspect that most posters on this board have little conception of a Christian who is (i) British, (ii) left-wing, (iii) full-blown supernaturalist (i.e. has the aforesaid Elwood P Dowd syndrome).
Reality is a hallucination caused by alcohol deprivation.

Only Satan can rebuke sin. The righteous don't know enough.

God is not dead. He was merely voted out of office.

You can do anything with anybody if you just save them the trouble of thinking.

#168 LFC

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Posted 24 May 2019 - 12:19 PM

View PostRich T Bikkies, on 24 May 2019 - 09:55 AM, said:

Yep. Nailed it. Just what I have done. I've been doing it for the last eight years. To God (or "my god", if you prefer), not any particular preacher. My only complaint about your word "codependent" is that it has a pejorative meaning that I feel is inappropriate in my case.

"You're going to burn in Hell for your evil!" --Any Number of American Evangelical "Christians"

You'll never cut it in America's brand of Christianism if you keep thinking for yourself rather than surrendering to the "truth." And to help you understand what the truth is at all times, heeeeerrrre's [insert American megachurch grifting preacher of your choice]!

Freudian Slip Alert: I accidentally typed "magachurch." Hmmmmm. I think that may become intentional from now on.
" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer

#169 HockeyDon

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Posted 24 May 2019 - 01:14 PM

View PostLFC, on 24 May 2019 - 12:19 PM, said:

Freudian Slip Alert: I accidentally typed "magachurch." Hmmmmm. I think that may become intentional from now on.

First MAGAt and now magachurch. You're on a roll!
Well, fuck.

How can I be expected to distinguish BS from reality when so much of my reality is utter BS?!

"There seems to be a lot of people dying of ignorance while living in the information age." my sister-in-law.

#170 LFC

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Posted 24 May 2019 - 01:30 PM

View PostHockeyDon, on 24 May 2019 - 01:14 PM, said:

First MAGAt and now magachurch. You're on a roll!

You might say that I'm at a whole different order fo MAGAtude. I wouldn't say that, but you might.
" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer

#171 LFC

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Posted 13 June 2019 - 08:20 AM

Looks like we have a new kind of Christian grift, this time targeted towards Catholics, and Rick Santorum is up to his santorum in it. And he's not even the worst player involved in this scam.

Quote

Former Sen. Rick Santorum (R-PA) and American Conservative Union chair Matt Schlapp have joined forces for a project that is so deliciously of the moment that it’s hard to believe it’s real: Cathio, a cryptocurrency for the religious right that seems to fuse grift and faith in one.

Cathio bills itself as a “turnkey solution for Catholic organizations to bring their financial transactions into alignment with their beliefs.”

According to the Financial Times, which broke the story on Tuesday, Cathio CEO Matthew Marcolini says that because platforms like Venmo and PayPal apparently back Planned Parenthood — an organization “antithetical to what the church teaches” — he founded a cryptocurrency company that offers parishioners a system for giving to churches and other religious organizations in a way that’s in accordance with sacrament.

PayPal has attracted criticism from anti-abortion advocates in part for a charitable giving program it runs that allows users to donate to Planned Parenthood chapters. Conservative groups have also criticized the payments firm, which owns Venmo, for its corporate support of the Center for Reproductive Rights. The Family Council, an anti-abortion evangelical group, lists PayPal as a corporate supporter of Planned Parenthood.

To attract members of the religious right put off by those activities, Cathio founder Marcolini enlisted his father-in-law: Santorum.

The former Pennsylvania senator has a perch on the company’s board that reportedly gives him a stake in the “benefit corporation.” So too does Schlapp, a high-profile Trump administration ally (and husband of White House Strategic Communications Director Mercedes Schlapp).

Santorum has also been “fundraising” for the project, according to the FT report, which also says that Cathio charges around a 2% transaction fee for “donations and remittances.”

According to documents reviewed by TPM, the crypto project has another figurehead helping to fulfill the holy mission of eschewing businesses that support Planned Parenthood: Cameron Chell, a Canadian citizen who co-founded and serves on the board of Cathio.

TPM found that Chell spent much of the late 1990s and 2000s fending off accusations of financial misconduct in the U.S. and Canada, thanks largely to his associations with shady characters. He has been barred from at least one stock exchange and founded a company that was delisted from the Nasdaq after a staffer engaged in fraud.

" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer

#172 Rue Bella

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Posted 13 June 2019 - 08:43 AM

View PostLFC, on 13 June 2019 - 08:20 AM, said:

Looks like we have a new kind of Christian grift, this time targeted towards Catholics, and Rick Santorum is up to his santorum in it. And he's not even the worst player involved in this scam.

Perhaps they should offer a 'free' prayer rag for each transaction, and up their commission to 3%
What is wrong with these people? ~ PG

No longer politically correct

#173 AnBr

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Posted 16 June 2019 - 09:54 AM

Posted Image
Pray for Trump: Psalm 109:8

"Science is more than a body of knowledge; it is a way of thinking. I have a foreboding of an America in my children's or grandchildren's time - when the United States is a service and information economy; when nearly all the key manufacturing industries have slipped away to other countries; when awesome technological powers arc in the hands of a very few, and no one representing the public interest can even grasp the issues; when the people have lost the ability to set their own agendas or knowledgeably question those in authority; when, clutching our crystals and nervously consulting our horoscopes, our critical faculties in decline, unable to distinguish between what feels good and what's true, we slide, almost without noticing, back into superstition and darkness.

— Carl Sagan
The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark
1995


“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

— H.L. Mencken
On Politics: A Carnival of Buncombe


“The test of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little.”

— Franklin Delano Roosevelt
Second inaugural address January, 1937

#174 Rue Bella

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Posted 16 June 2019 - 10:42 AM

View PostAnBr, on 16 June 2019 - 09:54 AM, said:

Posted Image

Cringe worthy, but this was better than any live Sunday morning sermon. Go and sin no more.

Happy Father's Day!
What is wrong with these people? ~ PG

No longer politically correct





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