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Republican Party has ‘flat out lost its mind’


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#61 Traveler

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Posted 16 November 2017 - 09:17 AM

Posted Image
"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened."-- Winston Churchill
"Anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices" Voltaire

#62 Traveler

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Posted 16 November 2017 - 09:19 AM

That is from VOX. for some reason, the image won't let me add text.
"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened."-- Winston Churchill
"Anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices" Voltaire

#63 golden_valley

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Posted 16 November 2017 - 11:24 AM

View PostTraveler, on 16 November 2017 - 09:19 AM, said:

That is from VOX. for some reason, the image won't let me add text.

My takeaway from that article is that Hannity traffics in "truthiness". Something doesn't have to be factually accurate to be convincing and accepted as true. It just has to conform with the listeners' beliefs so that it feels true. I guess you can call that confirmation bias. Thanks to Stephen Colbert, who talked about that in 2005, we know what it is but don't know how much it is relied upon to sway audiences and voters.

#64 LFC

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Posted 16 November 2017 - 03:15 PM

Josh Marshall to Republicans concerned about Roy Moore; you built this.

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Moore is managing to make an all or nothing, fight on principle over a growing list of allegations that he spent much of his thirties cruising the mall and local high schools trying to pick up high school girls and sometimes went as far as assaulting them. It’s a weird point of principle to say the least. But Moore is at least trying to make the allegations against him a secondary point in a battle between Moore as a true godly conservative and Mitch McConnell as the embodiment of the DC Swamp, coastal elites and RINO contempt for real Americans.

There seems to be little substantial erosion of Moore’s core support, at least so far. But in looking at this we need to see how the GOP didn’t just find itself in this situation. To paraphrase the 2012 line: they built this.

A year and a half ago, when talking about then candidate Donald Trump, I talked about the pattern …

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This crystallized for me after the last GOP debate when Trump told Chris Cuomo in a post-debate interview that the IRS might be coming after him because he’s a “strong Christian.” Set aside for the moment how this unchurched libertine was able to rebrand himself as a “strong Christian.” What about the preposterous claim that he is being persecuted by the IRS because he is a devout member of the country’s dominant religion? Republicans simply aren’t in any position to criticize this ludicrous claim because they have spent years telling their voters that this sort of thing happens all the time – to Christians, conservatives, everyone the liberals at the IRS hate. And this, of course, is just one example of hate and nonsense debt coming due. Shift gears now and they’re “RINOs.”

Moore is simply using the tools, tropes, and resentment politics Republican politicians have devised and honed and used now for decades – only he’s using it against them. It’s like an engineered virus which has escaped the lab. It’s very similar to what the same people faced again and again trying to grapple with Trump – who remains notably silent.

" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer

#65 LFC

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 04:40 PM

Dreher admits that conservatives have fallen much further into the arms of alternative facts than liberals and he fears the consequences. Here's the first part of the piece but it goes on.

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Look at these polling results, via HuffPo:

Posted Image

Only 18 percent of Trump voters think the allegations against Bill O’Reilly are credible, even though it was widely reported that Fox paid out $32 million to settle one woman’s claim against him, and ultimately fired him, even though he was a cash cow for the network.

And only six percent — six percent! — of Trump voters find allegations of sexual harassment against Trump credible, despite audio in which he bragged to Billy Bush about grabbing women’s genitals as a prelude to sexual congress.

[snip]

It’s one thing to say, “Yeah, he probably did it, but I support him anyway.” It’s quite another to deny that it happened, in spite of clear evidence.

(As a conservative, it pains me to observe that Hillary Clinton supporters are more clear-eyed about Bill Clinton and Harvey Weinstein. But there it is.)

A short while ago, on the recommendation of Washington Post book critic Carlos Lozada, who called it the year’s best book, I bought and downloaded Timothy Snyder’s short volume On Tyranny: Twenty Lessons From The Twentieth Century. Snyder, a historian who specializes in Germany between the wars, writes about things people today should do to resist the kinds of tyrannies that came to be in the previous century.

No. 10 is “Believe in truth.” Snyder writes:

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To abandon facts is to abandon freedom. If nothing is true, then on one can criticize power, because there is no basis upon which to do so. If nothing is true, then all is spectacle. The biggest wallet pays for the most blinding lights.

He goes on:

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You submit to tyranny when you renounce the difference between what you want to hear and what is actually the case. This renunciation of reality can feel natural and pleasant, but the result is your demise as an individual — and thus the collapse of any political system that depends upon individualism. … The first mode is the open hostility to verifiable reality, which takes the form of presenting inventions and lies as if they were facts.

Why are so many conservatives so eager to be lied to, to participate in lies, and to disbelieve the truth? Michael Gerson writes today about this administration’s avalanche of lies. Excerpts:

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In all of this [the Russia investigation], there is a spectacular accumulation of lies. Lies on disclosure forms. Lies at confirmation hearings. Lies on Twitter. Lies in the White House briefing room. Lies to the FBI. Self-protective lies by the attorney general. Blocking and tackling lies by Vice President Pence. This is, with a few exceptions, a group of people for whom truth, political honor, ethics and integrity mean nothing.

" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer

#66 D. C. Sessions

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 05:38 PM

Today's Krugman:

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A large part of the answer, I’d suggest, is that many Republicans now see themselves and/or their party in such dire straits that they’re no longer even trying to improve their future electoral position; instead, it’s all about grabbing as much for their big donors while they still can. Freedom’s just another word for nothing left to lose; in the GOP’s case, that means the freedom to be the party of, by, and for oligarchs they always wanted to be.

This calculus is clearest in the case of House members representing the kinds of districts — educated, relatively affluent, traditionally moderate Republican — that went Democratic by huge landslides in Virginia. If 2018 ends up being anything like what now seems likely, these members will need new jobs in 2019 whatever they do — and the best jobs will be as K Street lobbyists, except for a few who will get gigs as Fox News or “think tank” experts. In other words, one way or another their future lies in collecting wingnut welfare, which means that their incentives are entirely to be loyal ideologues even if it’s very much at their constituents’ expense.

With links:
A wave is a’ coming” says the Cook Political Report.
And when it comes to governorships, in which, oddly enough, the winner is the person who gets the most votes, a huge flip to Dems seems likely.
The way a lot of catastrophes happen is that X doesn't occur because there are safeguards in place, therefore people assume X isn't a worry and they remove the safeguards. Then X happens.
— Nate Silver
"Robots aren't the problem. Capitalism is." -- Last words of Stephen Hawking.
These days, "libertarian" is just a euphemism for a Nazi who's afraid to commit.
"If you're not outraged, you're not paying attention." -- Heather Heyer
"I'd rather have my child, but by golly, if I gotta give her up, we're gonna make it count." -- Her mother
"Your purpose, then, plainly stated, is that you will destroy the Government, unless you be allowed to construe and enforce the Constitution as you please, on all points in dispute between you and us. You will rule or ruin in all events." -- some RINO

#67 LFC

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 06:06 PM

More Republicans are regretting their part in the making of today's monster. It's still a trickle but if the GOP is hit with electoral avalanches in 2018 and 2020 they'll come out of their slimy little caves to decry how bad things have gotten ... if only to try to hold onto their jobs.

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Some conservative commentators are struggling to come to grips with the role that they played in creating a phenomenon like renegade Alabama candidate for U.S. Senate Roy Moore.

The Atlantic‘s Rosie Gray and McCay Koppins wrote on Friday that conservatives who sowed the wind by dismissing any information they disagree with as “fake news” are being forced to “reap the whirlwind of their war on the media” as Moore deflects credible charges of child sex predation by labeling them a conspiracy perpetrated by his political enemies.

“(I)n the Trump era, anti-press sentiment has reached a fever pitch on the right — something candidates like Moore are eagerly exploiting,” said The Atlantic, noting that President Donald Trump’s ascendency and combative style have mainstreamed the practice of denying all allegations and attacking the accusers.

“Their only response to this is really to find other villains in the process to take the heat off of them,” said John Brabender — a GOP strategist and former aide to ex-Sen. Rick Santorum (R-PA).

Moore and his camp have declared that The Washington Post and other media outlets are attacking them as part of a plot by Democrats and establishment Republicans like Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-KY).

Former talk show host Charlie Sykes acknowledges his own part in creating the media bubble from which conservatives get all of their news, effectively walling themselves off from viewpoints they find objectionable.

“These alternative-reality silos — not only do they reinforce an ideological message, but they can be impenetrable,” Sykes said to The Atlantic.

Sykes decried the “nightmare scenario” unfolding in Alabama, saying, “You have credible journalism being attacked and ignored amid a flood of misinformation and bizarre propaganda.”

Having hosted a conservative Milwaukee-area talk show for years, Sykes said conservative talkers need to come to grips with the role they played in training their audiences to rule out facts that don’t jibe with their beliefs.

“The trust in the media was already at a low point and by Trump constantly going after the media, it’s further eroded faith in the media and has actually activated people to be against it,” said Republican strategist and former RNC spokesman Doug Heye to Gray and Coppins. “That’s part of the tribalism we see in our politics, the erosion in all capital-I institutions.”

“I think we should be horrified by the monster we helped create,” said Sykes.

" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer

#68 AnBr

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Posted 22 November 2017 - 11:29 AM

Steve Schmidt: Trump’s defense of Roy Moore ‘exposes a profound moral rot in the Republican Party’

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“Tragic day for the Republican Party,” Republican strategist Steve Schmidt told MSNBC’s Chris Hayes.

“The line is drawn, the die are cast, the forces of decency are against the forces of indecency,” he continued. “This exposes a profound moral rot in the country, in the Republican Party. A great test for the citizens of state of Alabama.”

“We’ve reached the hour that George Washington warned us about,” the Republican said. “A political tribalism that’s so corrosive, so corrupting, that it could take otherwise normal, decent people that you’d encounter on any day, and make them defend the indefensible and the profoundly indecent. And it’s a sad moment.”

“Trump’s a stupid man’s idea of a smart person, a poor man’s idea of a rich person & a weak man’s idea of a strong man.”

— Fran Lebowitz


“One of the saddest lessons of history is this: If we've been bamboozled long enough, we tend to reject any evidence of the bamboozle. We’re no longer interested in finding out the truth. The bamboozle has captured us. It's simply too painful to acknowledge, even to ourselves, that we’ve been taken. Once you give a charlatan power over you, you almost never get it back.”

— Carl Sagan


Pray for Trump: Psalm 109:8

"Science is more than a body of knowledge; it is a way of thinking. I have a foreboding of an America in my children's or grandchildren's time - when the United States is a service and information economy; when nearly all the key manufacturing industries have slipped away to other countries; when awesome technological powers arc in the hands of a very few, and no one representing the public interest can even grasp the issues; when the people have lost the ability to set their own agendas or knowledgeably question those in authority; when, clutching our crystals and nervously consulting our horoscopes, our critical faculties in decline, unable to distinguish between what feels good and what's true, we slide, almost without noticing, back into superstition and darkness.

— Carl Sagan
The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark
1995


“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

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On Politics: A Carnival of Buncombe


“The test of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little.”

— Franklin Delano Roosevelt
Second inaugural address January, 1937

#69 golden_valley

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Posted 22 November 2017 - 12:02 PM

View PostAnBr, on 22 November 2017 - 11:29 AM, said:


Yeah well thanks a bunch Mr Schmidt. Your campaign vaulted Sarah Palin into the national consciousness and paved the way for Trump.

#70 Beelzebuddy

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Posted 22 November 2017 - 12:53 PM

View Postgolden_valley, on 22 November 2017 - 12:02 PM, said:

Yeah well thanks a bunch Mr Schmidt. Your campaign vaulted Sarah Palin into the national consciousness and paved the way for Trump.
Right? Way to close the barn door there Schmidt
Fear Sells!

Cui bono?

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#71 LFC

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Posted 22 November 2017 - 01:02 PM

I will repost the Voltaire quote I put up a few weeks or so ago.

Quote

Certainly any one who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices.

Actually here's the whole quote in context.

Quote

Once your faith, sir, persuades you to believe what your intelligence declares to be absurd, beware lest you likewise sacrifice your reason in the conduct of your life. In days gone by, there were people who said to us: "You believe in incomprehensible, contradictory and impossible things because we have commanded you to; now then, commit unjust acts because we likewise order you to do so." Nothing could be more convincing. Certainly any one who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices. If you do not use the intelligence with which God endowed your mind to resist believing impossibilities, you will not be able to use the sense of injustice which God planted in your heart to resist a command to do evil. Once a single faculty of your soul has been tyrannized, all the other faculties will submit to the same fate. This has been the cause of all the religious crimes that have flooded the earth. (Translation from Norman Lewis Torrey: Les Philosophes. The Philosophers of the Enlightenment and Modern Democracy. Capricorn Books, 1961, pp. 277-8)

" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer

#72 golden_valley

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Posted 22 November 2017 - 02:10 PM

This leaps out at me:


Quote

If you do not use the intelligence with which God endowed your mind to resist believing impossibilities, you will not be able to use the sense of injustice which God planted in your heart to resist a command to do evil.

Thanks for bringing up Voltaire.

#73 D. C. Sessions

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Posted 26 November 2017 - 08:12 AM

View PostAnBr, on 22 November 2017 - 11:29 AM, said:


"I'm shocked, shocked to find that (this) is going on in here!"
The way a lot of catastrophes happen is that X doesn't occur because there are safeguards in place, therefore people assume X isn't a worry and they remove the safeguards. Then X happens.
— Nate Silver
"Robots aren't the problem. Capitalism is." -- Last words of Stephen Hawking.
These days, "libertarian" is just a euphemism for a Nazi who's afraid to commit.
"If you're not outraged, you're not paying attention." -- Heather Heyer
"I'd rather have my child, but by golly, if I gotta give her up, we're gonna make it count." -- Her mother
"Your purpose, then, plainly stated, is that you will destroy the Government, unless you be allowed to construe and enforce the Constitution as you please, on all points in dispute between you and us. You will rule or ruin in all events." -- some RINO

#74 Sinan

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Posted 26 November 2017 - 10:14 AM

The inevitable outcome of the conservative movement was already known in the 50s and 60s, it was the John Birch Society. Buckley threw them out but they just morphed into something else, added the evangelicals, supported a salesman/actor to POTUS and then reaped the rewards of all that funding to create various think tanks that were then used by right wing media to rewrite history, spin lies as truths and sell the greed is good myth to racist rubes. They are not going anywhere folks and urban citizens better get used to it. We are set up to let the minority win under the illusion that a tyranny of the majority is our greatest fear. Well, here we are today and there is nothing we can do about it but grin and bear it.
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#75 D. C. Sessions

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Posted 26 November 2017 - 11:35 AM

Driving I-10 between Tucson and NM yesterday, I saw a billboard which declared "Regulation Without Representation is Tyranny!"

What can you do besides shake your head?
The way a lot of catastrophes happen is that X doesn't occur because there are safeguards in place, therefore people assume X isn't a worry and they remove the safeguards. Then X happens.
— Nate Silver
"Robots aren't the problem. Capitalism is." -- Last words of Stephen Hawking.
These days, "libertarian" is just a euphemism for a Nazi who's afraid to commit.
"If you're not outraged, you're not paying attention." -- Heather Heyer
"I'd rather have my child, but by golly, if I gotta give her up, we're gonna make it count." -- Her mother
"Your purpose, then, plainly stated, is that you will destroy the Government, unless you be allowed to construe and enforce the Constitution as you please, on all points in dispute between you and us. You will rule or ruin in all events." -- some RINO

#76 Rich T Bikkies

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Posted 26 November 2017 - 04:47 PM

View PostD. C. Sessions, on 26 November 2017 - 11:35 AM, said:

"Regulation Without Representation is Tyranny!"

Uh?
Reality is a hallucination caused by alcohol deprivation.

Only Satan can rebuke sin. The righteous don't know enough.

God is not dead. He was merely voted out of office.

You can do anything with anybody if you just save them the trouble of thinking.

#77 Rich T Bikkies

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Posted 26 November 2017 - 04:53 PM

@Sinan: yes. What happens if the maximal happy ending occurs in a few years: a Democrat in the White House, and the Democrats controlling both houses? Are they going to be any less cowardly than the ironically named Grand Old Party? Any less driven by greed and fear of their corporate donors?
Reality is a hallucination caused by alcohol deprivation.

Only Satan can rebuke sin. The righteous don't know enough.

God is not dead. He was merely voted out of office.

You can do anything with anybody if you just save them the trouble of thinking.

#78 D. C. Sessions

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Posted 26 November 2017 - 05:27 PM

RTB: The long answer is that the Democrats are a highly diverse coalition of interests (civil rights, generally pro-labour, centre-left, pluralistic, egalitarian, etc.) This makes it hard to mount any kind of radical agenda -- or any kind of party discipline, for that matter.

For good or ill.
The way a lot of catastrophes happen is that X doesn't occur because there are safeguards in place, therefore people assume X isn't a worry and they remove the safeguards. Then X happens.
— Nate Silver
"Robots aren't the problem. Capitalism is." -- Last words of Stephen Hawking.
These days, "libertarian" is just a euphemism for a Nazi who's afraid to commit.
"If you're not outraged, you're not paying attention." -- Heather Heyer
"I'd rather have my child, but by golly, if I gotta give her up, we're gonna make it count." -- Her mother
"Your purpose, then, plainly stated, is that you will destroy the Government, unless you be allowed to construe and enforce the Constitution as you please, on all points in dispute between you and us. You will rule or ruin in all events." -- some RINO

#79 Progressive whisperer

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Posted 26 November 2017 - 05:54 PM

View PostD. C. Sessions, on 26 November 2017 - 05:27 PM, said:

RTB: The long answer is that the Democrats are a highly diverse coalition of interests (civil rights, generally pro-labour, centre-left, pluralistic, egalitarian, etc.) This makes it hard to mount any kind of radical agenda -- or any kind of party discipline, for that matter.

For good or ill.

“i’m Not a member of any organized party; I’m a Democrat!”

Trump delenda est.
GOP delenda est.
Resist!

#80 AnBr

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Posted 26 November 2017 - 05:58 PM

View PostProgressive whisperer, on 26 November 2017 - 05:54 PM, said:

“i’m Not a member of any organized party; I’m a Democrat!”

Will Rogers would not recognize his home state anymore.
“Trump’s a stupid man’s idea of a smart person, a poor man’s idea of a rich person & a weak man’s idea of a strong man.”

— Fran Lebowitz


“One of the saddest lessons of history is this: If we've been bamboozled long enough, we tend to reject any evidence of the bamboozle. We’re no longer interested in finding out the truth. The bamboozle has captured us. It's simply too painful to acknowledge, even to ourselves, that we’ve been taken. Once you give a charlatan power over you, you almost never get it back.”

— Carl Sagan


Pray for Trump: Psalm 109:8

"Science is more than a body of knowledge; it is a way of thinking. I have a foreboding of an America in my children's or grandchildren's time - when the United States is a service and information economy; when nearly all the key manufacturing industries have slipped away to other countries; when awesome technological powers arc in the hands of a very few, and no one representing the public interest can even grasp the issues; when the people have lost the ability to set their own agendas or knowledgeably question those in authority; when, clutching our crystals and nervously consulting our horoscopes, our critical faculties in decline, unable to distinguish between what feels good and what's true, we slide, almost without noticing, back into superstition and darkness.

— Carl Sagan
The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark
1995


“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

— H.L. Mencken
On Politics: A Carnival of Buncombe


“The test of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little.”

— Franklin Delano Roosevelt
Second inaugural address January, 1937





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