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Filibuster Reform Rather Than Repeal?


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#21 LFC

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Posted 18 March 2021 - 05:14 PM

View PostProbabilistic, on 18 March 2021 - 08:05 AM, said:

Minority's overriding interest is becoming the majority in the next election. Stopping the majority from achieving legislative success is an important step in the process. Once that possibility has been removed the value of intractable obstruction is significantly reduced.

But for the GOP there's nothing they actually want to achieve other than tearing apart the social safety net and paying off their big donors. That means that if they can't block legislation they'll just continue with their righteous outrage strategy.
" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer

#22 JackD

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Posted 18 March 2021 - 07:56 PM

What they want to achieve is the privatization of all socially important areas of life; they want the law of the jungle.

#23 pnwguy

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Posted 18 March 2021 - 10:00 PM

View PostJackD, on 18 March 2021 - 07:56 PM, said:

What they want to achieve is the privatization of all socially important areas of life; they want the law of the jungle.
The jungle has social animals that thrive because of cooperation. Republicans forget they are grasshoppers and Democrats forget they are ants.
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#24 LFC

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Posted 19 March 2021 - 11:22 AM

The tide continues to turn.

Quote

Sen. Martin Heinrich (D-NM), one of the Democratic senators who previously threw their support behind preserving the filibuster, on Thursday evening joined the growing chorus of Democrats calling for the abolishment of the procedure.

Heinrich asserted in a statement that the filibuster, which requires most legislation to have a 60 votes in order to pass rather than a simple majority and has therefore become an effective tool for GOP obstruction, ought to at least be changed to a talking filibuster (a reform President Joe Biden and other Democrats have backed), if not blown up entirely.

“Too often the filibuster has been used to block our country’s continued march toward equality,” Heinrich said. “We must change this.”

The Democratic senator pointed at the notorious voter suppression efforts in Georgia, which largely targets its Black population, as a reason to get rid of the filibuster and allow Democrats to pass their For the People Act, a blockbuster voting rights bill known as H.R. 1, without Republicans getting in the way.

“We have the legislation to stop this. The For the People Act would restore voting rights to Americans targeted by efforts like those in Georgia,” Heinrich said. “We can’t let the filibuster continue to shield structural racism in our country.”

In the growing movement among Democratic senators to kill the filibuster, much of the focus has been on Sens. Joe Manchin (D-WV) and Kyrsten Sinema (D-AZ), who have loudly voiced support for the procedure. Less attention has been paid to Democrats like Heinrich who signed Sens. Susan Collins (R-ME) and Chris Coons’ (D-DE) letter pushing for the preservation of the filibuster in 2017 and have yet to fully reverse their stance. And some of those Democratic signatories, such as Sens. Dianne Feinstein (D-CA) and Angus King (I-ME), openly continue to support keeping the filibuster to this day.

However, H.R 1 has become a pressure point for Democrats who support or remain on the fence about the filibuster as Republicans across the country amp up their crusade to limit voting in wake of the 2020 elections.


And I repeat...

Quote

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer

#25 golden_valley

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Posted 19 March 2021 - 11:53 AM

 LFC, on 19 March 2021 - 11:22 AM, said:

The tide continues to turn.




And I repeat...

It has to be something that Manchin and Sinema support or it won't pass.

#26 AnBr

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Posted 20 March 2021 - 08:42 AM

Posted Image
“Trump’s a stupid man’s idea of a smart person, a poor man’s idea of a rich person & a weak man’s idea of a strong man.”

— Fran Lebowitz


“One of the saddest lessons of history is this: If we've been bamboozled long enough, we tend to reject any evidence of the bamboozle. We’re no longer interested in finding out the truth. The bamboozle has captured us. It's simply too painful to acknowledge, even to ourselves, that we’ve been taken. Once you give a charlatan power over you, you almost never get it back.”

— Carl Sagan


Pray for Trump: Psalm 109:8

"Science is more than a body of knowledge; it is a way of thinking. I have a foreboding of an America in my children's or grandchildren's time - when the United States is a service and information economy; when nearly all the key manufacturing industries have slipped away to other countries; when awesome technological powers arc in the hands of a very few, and no one representing the public interest can even grasp the issues; when the people have lost the ability to set their own agendas or knowledgeably question those in authority; when, clutching our crystals and nervously consulting our horoscopes, our critical faculties in decline, unable to distinguish between what feels good and what's true, we slide, almost without noticing, back into superstition and darkness.

— Carl Sagan
The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark
1995


“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

— H.L. Mencken
On Politics: A Carnival of Buncombe


“The test of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little.”

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#27 andydp

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Posted 22 March 2021 - 08:08 AM

Here we see what happens when you think you're being threatening.

This is what's known as a "Yea ? So what ?" moment. Reminds me of a story from Vietnam:

Fellow was an advisor to the RVN Army. He's out in a rice paddy knee deep in "fertilized" water, when some senior officer shows up and starts riding him about not wearing his helmet. Fellow responds: I'm standing knee deep in s***ty water, mosquitos and whatever are all arouind me and a sniper could take me down anytime. Exactly what MORE can you do to me ?

McConnell Threatens To Grind Senate To Halt If Dems Don’t Let Him Keep Power To Grind Senate To Halt

McConnell Threatens To Grind Senate To Halt If Dems Don’t Let Him Keep Power To Grind Senate To Halt (talkingpointsmemo.com)

Mitch needs lessons in threats from some NJ boys.
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I get it. They had a guy ratf**k the post office. They filled the courts with hacks. They spent a ton of money. They filed so many lawsuits. They even started a riot ! It’s so unfair that they went to all that trouble and still lost. Anonymous

#28 LFC

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Posted 22 March 2021 - 03:57 PM

Moscow Mitch came out swinging against Rep. John Yarmuth’s (D-KY) who wrote an op-ed about filibuster reform or repeal. He ended up supporting Yarmuth's case quite nicely.

Quote

Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-KY) appears to have inadvertently boosted Rep. John Yarmuth’s (D-KY) argument to reform or eliminate the filibuster in an op-ed the senator published in the the Courier Journal on Monday.

McConnell took aim at Yarmuth’s own op-ed published last week, which decried the Senate minority leader’s floor speech last week “frenetically predicting legislative Armageddon” in the chamber if Democrats were to go nuclear on the filibuster.

McConnell defended the filibuster by arguing that the procedure exists to “block bad ideas from becoming law and to encourage bipartisan solutions” — a point that Democratic senators like Yarmuth share, but with the concern that President Biden’s legislative agenda will hit more roadblocks if the reform or elimination of the filibuster doesn’t occur.

McConnell hit back at Yarmuth calling the filibuster a “minority veto” and defended the legislative roadblock as “Kentucky’s veto,” insinuating that senators from more populous states such as California or New York would have more weight in putting a stop to Republicans’ legislative priorities.

“As the only congressional leader not from New York or California, I put Kentucky’s priorities front and center,” McConnell wrote. “If Yarmuth had his way, Speaker Pelosi would have a free pass to leave Middle America out in the cold.”

But McConnell’s argument essentially proves Yarmuth’s point. As Vox pointed out in November, with Democrats securing both Senate seats in Georgia, the 50 Democratic senators represent 41.5 million more Americans than the 50 Republicans in the chamber. Kentucky’s population is about 4.5 million people, compared to about 39.5 million in California and 19.5 million in New York, respectively.

McConnell on Monday reiterated his stern stance last week against abolishing the filibuster, warning that “the broken Senate would hold endless votes” on Senate operations if Democrats eliminate the filibuster.

“Blowing up the Senate wouldn’t speed liberals’ ambitions, it would grind them to a halt,” McConnell wrote. “I guarantee it.”

" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer

#29 AnBr

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Posted 22 March 2021 - 07:58 PM

Posted Image
“Trump’s a stupid man’s idea of a smart person, a poor man’s idea of a rich person & a weak man’s idea of a strong man.”

— Fran Lebowitz


“One of the saddest lessons of history is this: If we've been bamboozled long enough, we tend to reject any evidence of the bamboozle. We’re no longer interested in finding out the truth. The bamboozle has captured us. It's simply too painful to acknowledge, even to ourselves, that we’ve been taken. Once you give a charlatan power over you, you almost never get it back.”

— Carl Sagan


Pray for Trump: Psalm 109:8

"Science is more than a body of knowledge; it is a way of thinking. I have a foreboding of an America in my children's or grandchildren's time - when the United States is a service and information economy; when nearly all the key manufacturing industries have slipped away to other countries; when awesome technological powers arc in the hands of a very few, and no one representing the public interest can even grasp the issues; when the people have lost the ability to set their own agendas or knowledgeably question those in authority; when, clutching our crystals and nervously consulting our horoscopes, our critical faculties in decline, unable to distinguish between what feels good and what's true, we slide, almost without noticing, back into superstition and darkness.

— Carl Sagan
The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark
1995


“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

— H.L. Mencken
On Politics: A Carnival of Buncombe


“The test of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little.”

— Franklin Delano Roosevelt
Second inaugural address January, 1937

#30 Probabilistic

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Posted 23 March 2021 - 08:41 AM

You know Mitch, once we get rid of the filibuster we can get rid of procedures that require endless voting. The excellent tactician you're, you must have considered this outcome too, right?

For example, lights can be set to turn on when there's motion. You heard of motion detectors, right? Even tortoises have to move sometimes.

#31 LFC

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Posted 24 March 2021 - 09:12 AM

Moscow Mitch is threatening the Democrats with continuing to do what he's been doing for over a decade. Sorry, Mitch, but by deciding on a course of 100% obstruction you defanged that threat long ago. You're literally threatening that nothing will be different.

Quote

Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-KY) said during an interview that aired Tuesday, that the Senate would turn into “a sort of nuclear winter” if Democrats succeeded in eliminating the filibuster.

“If they turn the Senate into a simple majority body, the Senate is lost,” McConnell said during a conservative podcast interview with “Ruthless,” released Tuesday.

“It may not be the panacea that they anticipate it would be, it could turn the Senate into sort of a nuclear winter, where the aftermath of the so-called nuclear option is not a sustainable place,” McConnell added.

The comments come after McConnell issued a dire threat as a growing number of Senate Democrats in recent weeks signaled interest in filibuster reform.

“Nobody serving in this chamber can even begin, even begin to imagine what a completely scorched-earth Senate would look like,” McConnell said last week.

Senate aides told Axios that McConnell would be very strategic in taking advantage of other Senate rules to frustrate Democrats and stall progress in the chamber, among them, unnecessary quorum calls, pausing business to ensure all 100 senators are on the floor, lengthy debates about motions, and introducing long amendments to stretch out proceedings.

Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer (D-NY) had previously brushed off McConnell’s threats during an interview with CBS’ Stephen Colbert.

“We’re not going to be deterred. We’re going to go forward because we know the American people demand, need, want bold change,” Schumer said on “The Late Show” last week. “And we’re going to do it. Mitch McConnell can do all the threatening and bluster he wants. It’s not going to stop us.”


Just for good measure MM puts a dagger in the heart of irony.

Quote

McConnell further accused Democrats during the Tuesday interview of having no interest in compromise.

“These folks are not interested in compromise, they’re interested in passing all of their bills to remake America,” he said in the Tuesday interview.

The call for compromise, follows efforts by McConnell in 2017 to set a new precedent that lowered the threshold on Supreme Court nominations to end debate from 60 to 51 votes to confirm then President Donald Trump’s Supreme Court nominee Neil Gorsuch. The change did not affect the legislative filibuster, but it certainly bucked compromise.

“This will be the first, and last, partisan filibuster of a Supreme Court justice,” said McConnell in a closing floor speech at the time.

" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer

#32 LFC

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Posted 29 March 2021 - 12:29 PM

Sen. Pat Toomey (R-PAck Up And Leave) proves he's still a right-wing douchebag by playing the "race card card." They hate when they get called out on racist shit, whether present or past. Little Lindsey doesn't need to prove he's still a right-wing douchebag but is right there with him.

Quote

While Psaki was questioned on whether the filibuster is “racist” or “wrong,” Graham and Toomey attempted to defend the Senate procedure on Sunday by accusing Democrats of pulling the “race card.”

Graham, who also appeared on “Fox News Sunday,” accused Biden of playing the “race card” when the President decried the Georgia’s new overhaul of its election rules in a blistering statement last week. Biden argued that Republican state lawmakers rushed “through an un-American law to deny people the right to vote.”

“What’s sick is for the President of the United States to play the race card continuously in such a hypocritical way,” Graham said on “Fox News Sunday.”

Graham continued accusing Democrats of playing “the race card” when he took aim at Biden over the President’s support for reforming the filibuster, and criticized Democrats’ HR1 (also known as the “For the People Act”) as being the biggest “power grab” in US history.

“Every time a Republican does anything, we’re racist,” Graham said on “Fox News Sunday.” “They use the racism card to advance a liberal agenda, and we’re tired of it.”

Toomey offered a similar take when defending the filibuster during an interview on MSNBC’s “Meet the Press” on Sunday.

Toomey argued that Democratic lawmakers are making a “shameful attempt” to “really ruin” what he believes to be “what remains of the functioning” of the upper chamber.

“You know, two years ago, the Democrats pretty much universally supported keeping the filibuster. Barack Obama was in favor of the filibuster,” Toomey said. “Now, when the different party is in control and suddenly it’s become a racist tool. How ridiculous.”

Later in the interview, Toomey dismissed the notion that the new Georgia voting law constitutes “voter suppression,” before going on to tie Democrats’ criticism of the battleground state’s new voting legislation to their calls to reform the filibuster. Toomey doubled down on his argument that Republicans are unfairly being painted as “racists.”

“This has been a false narrative entirely, and I’m afraid it’s all about trying to get rid of the filibuster,” Toomey said, referring to the new Georgia voting law. “We’re not going to be cowed by being called racist over policy that has nothing to do with race.”


I'll say it again, guys. It's really easy to avoid being painted as racists. STOP DOING RACIST SHIT!
" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer

#33 golden_valley

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Posted 29 March 2021 - 12:45 PM

View PostLFC, on 29 March 2021 - 12:29 PM, said:

Sen. Pat Toomey (R-PAck Up And Leave) proves he's still a right-wing douchebag by playing the "race card card." They hate when they get called out on racist shit, whether present or past. Little Lindsey doesn't need to prove he's still a right-wing douchebag but is right there with him.




I'll say it again, guys. It's really easy to avoid being painted as racists. STOP DOING RACIST SHIT!

It's all part of the grievance culture. It hurts their feelings and is unfair because they have never lynched a Black person. I'm particularly struck by the hurt feelings over the Georgia voting & elections reform being called "Jim Crow 2.0." There are no signs saying whites only at the polling places so it can't possibly be Jim Crow.





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