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Trump's Supposed Foreign Policy "Pivot"


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#21 Rue Bella

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Posted 08 October 2019 - 09:53 AM

"What a f***ing dipshit" indeed.

Thanks James Comey and your concern about 'the emails'.
Thanks Susan Sarandon and your ilk.
Thanks Bernie and all your idiot 'bots.
Thanks to the self-righteous Evangelicals. I have nothing but disgust for you.

Is it burned down enough for you yet? Perhaps the Kurds can give you their opinion.
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#22 LFC

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Posted 08 October 2019 - 10:00 AM

The Kurds have apparently been preparing to be betrayed by Trump. You can read the whole TDB piece but this one quote from Trump really sums up one situation or another for him; the perception that it costs MONEY. Lives don't matter. Only cold, hard cash.

Quote

But U.S. President Donald Trump has put a price on all this. “The Kurds fought with us,” he tweeted, “but were paid massive amounts of money and equipment to do so.” That they saved countless lives in the process, including American lives, does not seem to have been a factor.

" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer

#23 golden_valley

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Posted 08 October 2019 - 10:07 AM

View PostLFC, on 08 October 2019 - 10:00 AM, said:

The Kurds have apparently been preparing to be betrayed by Trump. You can read the whole TDB piece but this one quote from Trump really sums up one situation or another for him; the perception that it costs MONEY. Lives don't matter. Only cold, hard cash.

Everything is a business deal to him. You decide to pull out of a contract, you pull out. You figure it out in court later if someone is unhappy about it.

#24 D. C. Sessions

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Posted 08 October 2019 - 12:29 PM

View Postgolden_valley, on 08 October 2019 - 10:07 AM, said:

Everything is a business deal to him. You decide to pull out of a contract, you pull out. You figure it out in court later if someone is unhappy about it.

And lives to go broke litigating the breach.
The way a lot of catastrophes happen is that X doesn't occur because there are safeguards in place, therefore people assume X isn't a worry and they remove the safeguards. Then X happens.
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#25 golden_valley

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Posted 08 October 2019 - 01:05 PM

View PostD. C. Sessions, on 08 October 2019 - 12:29 PM, said:

And lives to go broke litigating the breach.

Trump said it. They were paid and equipped. Like he told the war widow, your husband knew what he signed up for.

#26 Traveler

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Posted 08 October 2019 - 01:12 PM

Quote

Referencing the easy relationship, as he saw it, between ISIS and the Turkish intelligence and military, Abu Mansour claimed, an ISIS emir could “go to Ankara without a problem. They always sent a car, or a bodyguard. At one point, we met weekly, depending on the issue and its importance to Turkey and to us, according to the demand.”

The situation described by Abu Mansour raises a question: did the ultimate defeat of ISIS in fact deprive the Turks of the proxy buffer zone they wanted—which they are now invading Syria to establish?

Abu Mansour recalled, “Turkey asked on many occasions for a safe zone.” This would be a demilitarized zone where it would provide ISIS with whatever it wanted, but only inside Syrian territories. According to Abu Mansour, , ISIS refused to grant it, and relations started to fall apart.
Kind of reminds me of SA. With allies like that, who needs enemies?
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#27 LFC

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Posted 10 October 2019 - 08:30 AM

Trump isn't worried about thousands of ISIS prisoners escaping because they're going back to Europe. Yes, he said it out loud.

Quote

President Trump has dismissed concerns that Turkey's incursion into northern Syria could enable hundreds of hardened ISIS fighters to go free as a problem for other countries. There are more than 10,000 ISIS detainees held in jails across northern Syria run by America's long-time Kurdish allies, the Syrian Democratic Forces (SDF). The Kurds had warned that a Turkish offensive against them, which began on Wednesday, would force them to turn their attention from ISIS, to self defense.

About 2,500 of the ISIS detainees held in Syria are believed to be highly dangerous foreign fighters from Europe and elsewhere. On Wednesday, the U.S. military confirmed to CBS News that it had taken custody of two of those prisoners, a pair of British nationals suspected of involvement in the brutal murder of American hostages.

"Face the Nation" host Margaret Brennan said Thursday that some other ISIS suspects who had been held jointly by the U.S. and the Kurds were also being moved into military custody. But speaking on Wednesday, Mr. Trump seemed unconcerned by warnings that thousands of other ISIS fighters — and thousands of their family members who are held in separate facilities in the region, including many who still sympathize with the extremist group — could escape amid mounting chaos.

"Well they're going to be escaping to Europe, that's where they want to go, they want to go back to their homes," Mr. Trump said at the White House.

The SDF, former U.S. military officials and serving American lawmakers — including one of Mr. Trump's staunchest supporters in Congress — have warned the president's decision to move American forces out of northern Syria to make way for the Turkish incursion targeting the Kurds could give ISIS room to regroup.

They have also chastised Mr. Trump for what they say amounts to an abandonment of a U.S. ally that lost 11,000 lives helping American forces push ISIS out of northern Syria.

" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer

#28 Probabilistic

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Posted 10 October 2019 - 12:03 PM

The Italians, the Germans, the Dutch did not help out in Normandy. Russia if you're listening, go ahead invade. We are not going to defend these countries even if they're members of NATO. So no security guarantee for y'all.

The Japanese did not help us on the Pacific front. So Kimmy boy, whenever you're good with your medium range missiles have at them.

#29 LFC

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Posted 10 October 2019 - 01:32 PM

TDB has a good explanation of Trump's foreign policy. It's effectively Vladimir Putin's wish list. Here's much of the article but there's more that's equally cringeworthy.

Quote

President Donald J. Trump’s surprise decision to abandon the Kurds and sign off on Turkey’s operation in Syria drew condemnation in the West, but was cheerfully welcomed in Russia, and, for those who follow Russia closely, the contrast revived the ghosts of Helsinki, where Trump’s surrender of American values was on full display.

There in Finland last year, the leader of the most powerful country in the world demonstrated cringeworthy servility toward Vladimir Putin—president of a rogue government sanctioned by the West for a great number of malign activities, including Russia’s brazen interference in the U.S. elections.

The world’s pariah looked triumphant next to the deflated American president. As Trump stood hunched over, with a blank expression, Putin was practically glowing—and he wanted the world to know just how great the meeting went for Russia. Putin held up a thick stack of his notes with both hands, showing them off for the world to see, in effect giving himself the thumbs-up.

Discernible portions of the first page, purposely written in abnormally large script, included references to the election interference, Putin’s request that Russia be allowed to interrogate the former U.S. Ambassador to Russia, Michael McFaul, and also the British businessman Bill Browder, pursuant to the 1999 Treaty with Russia on Mutual Legal Assistance in Criminal Matters. There was a reference to the Nord Stream 2 pipeline. And at the bottom of the first page, Putin’s notes also mentioned Syria, where Russia has been wreaking havoc and committing mass atrocities in concert with Syrian dictator Bashar Assad and Iran.

For public consumption, the Russian president’s handwriting mentioned “joint humanitarian operations with the goal of creating conditions for the return of refugees.” The reality on the ground tends to create—not dissipate—the flood of refugees, essentially weaponized by Russia and Syria to destabilize Europe.

On Wednesday this week, President Trump nonchalantly commented that if the thousands of ISIS prisoners that are currently being held by U.S.-backed Kurdish forces escape, "they will be escaping to Europe." Turkey’s President Recep Tayyip Erdogan is also threatening Europe with a flood of refugees, publicly proclaiming, “We will open the gates and send 3.6 million refugees your way.”

Mystery surrounds the rest of the topics discussed by the President of the United States with the Russian leader in Helsinki, since President Trump confiscated the American interpreter’s notes and remains tight-lipped about his exchanges with Vladimir Putin. But one thing is clear: Trump is moving down Putin’s wish list, fulfilling the Kremlin’s aims at a rapid pace. He is chipping away at U.S. sanctions against Russia, deepening America’s internal divisions on the basis of race, faith, sexual orientation and political affiliation, vocally undermining confidence in our elections, intelligence agencies and institutions, all the while empowering our foreign adversaries and undermining NATO alliances.

Trump’s claims that Ukraine—not Russia— is somehow responsible for the 2016 election interference fall right in line with conspiracy theories the Kremlin has been propagating for years. The Russians have long been promoting the notions that prompted President Trump’s outrageous demands from the President of Ukraine, Volodymyr Zelensky, ultimately leading to the commencement of the impeachment proceedings.

The ousting of Marie Yovanovitch, the former ambassador to Ukraine, was also in line with the Kremlin’s wishes. She stood up for Ukraine’s interests, opposing Russia’s aggressive posture with respect to Donbas. Ukrainian politician Viktor Medvedchuk, a close ally of Russia's Vladimir Putin—who is the godfather of Medvedchuk’s daughter—has a longstanding grudge against Ambassador Yovanovitch. Medvedchuk cheered for the U.S. Ambassador to be recalled and the Russian state media predicted that Ambassador Yovanovitch would be Trump’s “first victim in Ukraine.”

Russia’s fingerprints seem to appear on every controversial foreign policy decision undertaken by President Trump. Prior to Turkey’s ongoing offensive against the Kurds, Turkish President Erdogan met with his Russian and Iranian counterparts, reaching "important decisions."

All three leaders avoided providing specifics on the talks. Russian state media proudly boasted that Erdogan secured Putin’s approval for Turkey’s offensive in northern Syria before speaking to Trump. Vladimir Soloviev, the host of the nightly program The Evening With Vladimir Soloviev on Russian state television, said that the Turkish president ran his plans by his Russian counterpart, securing his approval during their personal exchanges.

Soloviev added sarcastically that Erdogan was “not quite as delicate” with the president of the United States, implying that the American president was simply put on notice as to the deals that were already struck by Turkey, Russia and Iran.

" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer

#30 pnwguy

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Posted 10 October 2019 - 01:32 PM

View PostProbabilistic, on 10 October 2019 - 12:03 PM, said:

The Italians, the Germans, the Dutch did not help out in Normandy. Russia if you're listening, go ahead invade. We are not going to defend these countries even if they're members of NATO. So no security guarantee for y'all.

The Japanese did not help us on the Pacific front. So Kimmy boy, whenever you're good with your medium range missiles have at them.
If they aren't bringing envelopes of cash to the crime family, or sucking off his ego penis, those countries are "dead to me".
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#31 JackD

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Posted 10 October 2019 - 03:26 PM

"Vladimir Putin's wish list": the President of the United States is a Russian agent. How much Russian money is invested in or loaned to his enterprises should be investigated.

#32 LFC

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Posted 11 October 2019 - 10:47 AM

There were no troop withdrawals in Syria, just moving them out of the way so Turkey could slaughter the Kurds.

Quote

To listen to President Donald Trump and his defenders, he’s ended a foolish and previously indefinite war in Syria. “We have no soldiers in the area, you know. We’re getting out of the endless wars. We have to do it,” Trump said Wednesday in the Oval Office. “We are out of there. We’ve been out of there for a while. No soldiers whatsoever.” He added on Thursday, “We have no soldiers in Syria.”

That is untrue.

Two knowledgeable U.S. officials confirmed to The Daily Beast that after a shocking week that has upended U.S. planning, the U.S. military has only pulled back from northern Syria, not pulled out. It’s abandoned two small observation posts in the area Turkey has now invaded. Around 50 service members have moved to a larger base, something both officials described as a force protection measure—protection amid the already bloody Turkish incursion, protection that no longer exists for the Kurdish force that the U.S. relied upon to assault the so-called Islamic State. None of the roughly 1,000 U.S. troops have actually left Syria since Trump’s fateful Sunday phone call with Recep Tayyip Erdogan.

Instead, the U.S. military is currently in a holding pattern in Syria, one that many with experience in the endless wars that have ravaged a generation of Americans, Iraqis, Syrians and others consider a wrenching position. While actual withdrawal orders may yet come, for the beginning phase of Turkey’s attack on the Syrian Kurds, the Americans have ended no war, nor even their involvement in one. Instead, they’ve stood aside so their NATO ally can kill their anti-ISIS partner.

“I don’t know the tactical rationale for this,” said a former Pentagon official. “We’ve just exposed our partners. It’s a struggle for people of a ‘globalist,’ institutionalist [bent] – people who fought and bled with our partners – to understand.”

" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer

#33 LFC

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Posted 11 October 2019 - 12:55 PM

Oh for f***'s sake ...

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Secretary of Defense Mark Esper will be deploying up to 1800 new troops into the Middle East in response to the tensions caused when President Donald Trump pulls U.S. forces out of Northern Syria. The Commander-in-Chief’s move has led to dozens of deaths, mostly civilians, and the displacement of at least 100,000 people, after Turkish dictator Recep Erdogan began an immediate assault on the Kurds, who are allies of the U.S. and helped in the fight against ISIS.

Bloomberg News reports the “new deployment of U.S. forces to the Middle East” will begin “as tensions rise over Turkey’s military operations in northern Syria and an explosion on an Iranian oil tanker.”

In defending his highly-criticized decision to withdraw U.S. troops from Northern Syria, Trump repeatedly said he was fulfilling his promise to end “endless wars.”


... and for f***'s sake #2.

Quote

Almost a month has passed since the September 14 attack on Saudi Arabia’s oil facilities, which members of both President Donald Trump’s administration and the Saudi government have blamed on Iran. And on Friday, according to Reuters, the Pentagon confirmed that the U.S. will be sending a large military deployment to Saudi Arabia to help Saudi forces.

In an official statement, Jonathan Hoffman, a spokesman for the Pentagon, said, “Taken together with other deployments, this constitutes an additional 3,000 forces that have been extended or authorized within the last month.”

The Pentagon, according to Reuters, said the military aid for Saudi Arabia will range from air defense personnel to fighter squadrons. Following the September 14 attack, Trump’s administration has reiterated that it considers Saudi Arabia a valuable ally of the United States.


Trump is a dangerous f***ing idiot.
" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer

#34 baw1064

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Posted 11 October 2019 - 01:14 PM

View PostJackD, on 10 October 2019 - 03:26 PM, said:

How much Russian money is invested in or loaned to his enterprises...
The answer is "enough".
“Unless someone like you cares a whole awful lot, Nothing is going to get better. It's not.” --Dr. Seuss

#35 gmat

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Posted 13 October 2019 - 02:35 PM

A lot of graphic footage of summary executions of Kurds by Turkish-backed militia is emerging online. Definitely not a good look for the policy of the US president. Pretty disgusting.

(I cant bring myself to link to it)

#36 JackD

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Posted 13 October 2019 - 03:56 PM

And by the way, the Kurds did fight with the allies in WWII and the Turks didn't.

#37 AnBr

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Posted 13 October 2019 - 05:42 PM

View PostJackD, on 13 October 2019 - 03:56 PM, said:

And by the way, the Kurds did fight with the allies in WWII and the Turks didn't.

Posted Image

https://en.wikipedia...aq_Levies#1940s
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#38 D. C. Sessions

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Posted 13 October 2019 - 07:43 PM

View PostLFC, on 11 October 2019 - 12:55 PM, said:

Quote

Trump’s administration has reiterated that it considers Saudi Arabia a valuable ally of the United States.


Like the Kurds?
The way a lot of catastrophes happen is that X doesn't occur because there are safeguards in place, therefore people assume X isn't a worry and they remove the safeguards. Then X happens.
— Nate Silver
"Robots aren't the problem. Capitalism is." -- Last words of Stephen Hawking.
These days, "libertarian" is just a euphemism for a Nazi who's afraid to commit.
"If you're not outraged, you're not paying attention." -- Heather Heyer
"I'd rather have my child, but by golly, if I gotta give her up, we're gonna make it count." -- Her mother
"Your purpose, then, plainly stated, is that you will destroy the Government, unless you be allowed to construe and enforce the Constitution as you please, on all points in dispute between you and us. You will rule or ruin in all events." -- some RINO

#39 baw1064

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Posted 13 October 2019 - 08:22 PM

View PostD. C. Sessions, on 13 October 2019 - 07:43 PM, said:

Like the Kurds?

What he's saying is he's grateful to the Saudis for bailing out his insolvent business ventures this month. And as long as they keep paying, they're a *valuable* ally.
“Unless someone like you cares a whole awful lot, Nothing is going to get better. It's not.” --Dr. Seuss

#40 LFC

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Posted 14 October 2019 - 08:15 AM

View PostD. C. Sessions, on 13 October 2019 - 07:43 PM, said:

Like the Kurds?

F*** the Kurds. They don't even have a place to build a Trump hotel.
" 'Individual conscience' means that women only get contraceptives if their employers, their physicians, their pharmacists, their husbands and/or fathers, pastors, and possibly their mayors, Governors, State Secretaries of Health, Congressmen, Senators, and President all agree that in that particular case they're justifiable." --D.C. Sessions

"That's the problem with being implacable foes - no one has any incentive to treat you as anything more than an obstacle to be overcome."

"The 'Road to Serfdom' is really all right turns." --Progressive Whisperer

""The GOP ... where every accusation is also a confession." --Progressive Whisperer





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